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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 13:54:52 GMT -5
To my shock and disgust, the majority opinion here and on Rangerboard seems to be that Dimensions in Danger is somehow better than Once a Ranger and I am beside myself at such a wild claim.
OAR was a two part episode with an original Monster costume that was the son of the OG villains, who even used Zedd's staff. Sure it was a bit weird how he seemed to exist for a long time despite allegedly only being born ten years ago, but still, they put in substantial effort! Then they brought together the Retro team, giving each ranger a badass intro, some in suit helmetless footage, multiple fight scenes together where they all seemed to have greathemistry as a team, solo umorphed foghts that highlighted all of their civilian powers, They got original footage of them piloting the Overdrive Zords. Full morph sequences for each one, which included filming and designing two original morphs for Bridge and Adam. A substantial final battle that paired everybody up, and which even included Adam wearing the Overdrive armor. Updates on how all of their lives and careers are going. And then the Overdrive team were given a decent plot about feeling replaced, but then deciding to be heroic anyway.
It was pretty lame how Sentinel Knight killed Thrax instead of Adam, but beyond that there was so much effort and originality put into that special.
Conversley DID was a terribly paced mess, the villain was just another MOTW who seemed weaker than your average monster, they used WAY too much sentai footage which saw the Ninja Steel team eat up priceless minutes that could have been used on creating something resembling a plot. Just like Legendary Battle, The returning rangers (mostly) didn't do anything. They didn't even show TJ or Trent fighting anyone at the end. They all could have mostly been stand-ins since they didn't do anything relevant to their personalities or characters. Gemma didn't get excited about any explosions. Was Kat supposed to be Tommy's wife? The best previous season homage was Gia, because her doing absolutely nothing is an exact call back to her role in her own season.
So someone needs to explain to me why on earth people hate OAR so much when it put in 100x more effort. Please.
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Post by Venusaur on Aug 29, 2018 14:21:46 GMT -5
Because its an Operation Overdrive two-parter
Koichisplosions out the a$$
The Overdrive Rangers obnoxious personalities are front and center (if the Ninja Steel Rangers are normally annoying they dont display it in this episode since they all kind of take second stage)
Because Thrax as a villain makes no sense. He has thousands years of history but he was born in like 97/98
And Overdrive, for me, personally is such an ugly ass season. The cgi is so so bad. The fight choreography is a joke (I wasnt that impressed by Ninja Steel’s either). The sound effects are ear bleeding. The hell they did to Alpha 6’s voice.
The main point is that it’s an Operation Overdrive two-parter with with all the failings that implies
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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 14:32:22 GMT -5
(if the Ninja Steel Rangers are normally annoying they dont display it in this episode since they all kind of take second stage) I feel like I must have watched a different episode because I couldn't disagree with this harder. Ninja Steel were front and center the whole time to me, especially that whole fight scene at the temple that added absolutely nothing. And then Tommy got to do some stuff and then apparently there were blink and you'll miss it appearances from other rangers. How is Draven better than Thrax? Here's what we know about him: 1) He exists. 2) ...uh... ?And for what it's worth, they normally are annoying, at least the red and blue ones. Brody says "That was EPIC" every ten seconds so the teamup finishing with that was gag indicing.
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Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 29, 2018 14:38:55 GMT -5
The son of the OG Villains, yeah. Cool idea. Too bad it makes zero sense on how he's so old and has a history with the Sentinel Knight. The Overdrive rangers decide they don't wanna help anymore pretty much because they aren't the center of attention. "Alpha" was annoying.
Dimensions in Danger wasn't perfect, it was rushed and not everything made perfect sense. But at least we had a cool idea delivered in a decent way, (I'd argue pretty good way) and we even got some confirmation on some stuff that we weren't completely sure of. Tommy and Kat are married with a kid, Dino Charge and RPM are confirmed to be the only two seasons in another dimension.
The only thing I can say is superior is that the final fight in OAR was longer, but even that fight didn't have the Falconzord.
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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 14:52:38 GMT -5
The Overdrive rangers decide they don't wanna help anymore pretty much because they aren't the center of attention. Tommy and Kat are married with a kid, Dino Charge and RPM are confirmed to be the only two seasons in another dimension. The only thing I can say is superior is that the final fight in OAR was longer, but even that fight didn't have the Falconzord. 1) What? The Overdrive Rangers lost their powers and were dismissed by Sentinel Knight. They didn't "decide they don't wanna help." In fact they were disappointed that they were told to go back to their regular lives. 2) Tommy and Kat are married? Too bad they didn't interact whatsoever. They didn't even truly confirm that. We know Tommy has a kid in his Dino Thunder house and he briefly held Kat's hand. That's it. We can assume they are, but in a truly good episode we wouldn't have to. Show, don't tell. Show Tommy getting stressed that his wife is kidnapped. Show him relieved when he saves her. Hell, have JJ say "Dad, Mom went missing btw." Instead he didn't even care, he saved Antonio first and he had a more romantic moment with Wes than with her. And didn't we already know this about the dimensions? Everybody seems to be so glad that they "confirmed" something I thought we already knew thanks to Clash of the Red Rangers and Sledge in SNS ep 1. 3) The only thing was the longer fight scene? Not the fact that each returnee actually did something? That they each had a callback to their career? Or each had an unmorphed fight scene highlighting their skills? The morph and roll call? I mainly don't see why everyone's letting the fact that Rocky, Kat, TJ, Trent, Antonio and Gia did absolutely nothing slide when everyone hated Legendary Battle for the exact same reason.
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Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 29, 2018 15:15:37 GMT -5
1) What? The Overdrive Rangers lost their powers and were dismissed by Sentinel Knight. They didn't "decide they don't wanna help." In fact they were disappointed that they were told to go back to their regular lives. It's been a little while since I've seen Once a Ranger, but I do remember they lost their powers. But they still had their civilian powers, they could've stayed and did something. Most other rangers would've. They did show. It's just not enough for some people. They had a subtle reveal that they were together. They didn't need to turn to the camera and say that they're married. It was still debated by some people. We got some solid proof by now. I kinda counted the morph and roll call in the fight thing, because that's where it happened. And really, did they all actually do something? I can't really remember one thing that Tori, Kira, or Bridge actually did in those two episodes outside of what everyone else was doing. (Except Bridge being Bridge, which was enjoyable) Because unlike Legendary Battle, everybody got to speak, and we got to see the current rangers fighting side by side with the legendary rangers instead of just sentai footage mixed with the current rangers talking too much. But, I do wanna make it clear that I don't even hate Once a Ranger. I just think Dimensions in Danger is better.
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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 16:07:15 GMT -5
But Sentinel Knight was like "okay you guys can leave, you serve no purpose anymore." It would have been weird and petulant for them to demand to stay and wash the zords or something. And Mack did stay and try to provide minimal help. Mainly cuz he had nowhere else to go, but still lol. The rest all had adullt jobs that would pay them and be more fulfilling than being the loser depowered sidekicks. But then they DID all give that up so that they could find a weapon that would help the Retro Rangers.
And to be clear, I really don't like the Overdrive Rangers or that season in general, but I thought the teamup was done well and the claim that "they decided they didn't wanna help" was inaccurate and uncharitable to them, imo.
The Tommy/Kat thing we're discussing elsewhere.
And when I say "doing aomething" I mean things like Kira using her Ptera scream in the solo fight, her awesome mid-air battle against Kamdor, and then revealing that she's dropping an album soon, which is consistent with her character in Dino Thunder AND the knowledge that she's a big star in SPD. Each ranger got stuff like that, which wasn't extensive really, but it's what makes seeing them again fun. And little continuity service like Adam and Kira discussing Tommy.
Compare this episode. What is Rocky up to? Did he even use the Power Sword? (maybe he did, the fight was too short for me to notice). Has Trent gotten anywhere in his art career? Sure the returning rangers got to speak but it was just empty lines like "oh no he's shooting an arrow" or "you guys will be fine." Something like Kat saying "Hey Trent can you and Kira babysit JJ next Saturday? It's our anniversary" would be a simple little line but rich in history and continuity. That's what I expect from an anniversary, actually honoring the past.
And did we even see each ranger fighting together. I don't think TJ or Trent actually got a spotlight moment. Which really makes me feel bad for Selwyn, this is twice now he's been shafted hard.
And who knows, maybe there will be an extended cut that will feature all that. But the cut we got I felt was a disservice to everyone who wasn't Tommy. And I like Tommy,
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Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 29, 2018 16:33:06 GMT -5
But again, they weren't completely powerless. Mack had super strength, Ronny had super speed... they still could've been of some use when fighting at least the Chillers/Lava Lizards. It just seems weird that after having years of rangers preaching "NEVER GIVE UP!" that's... pretty much exactly what we see them do for a while. Give up.
Agreed on the Tommy/Kat thing.
Okay... if that's the case, Kira really didn't have much more to do than Wes, apart from learning where she's up to. We see Wes leaping through the air with his weapon to take down the clone rangers. We see him charging in and helping Gemma shoot the controls to free the others rangers. (Which Tommy gets the thanks for, which is... just why?) Are the moments a little smaller than Kira's? Yeah, a little. But they were at least cool moments that we see the rangers do, which is pretty much what you can say for half the returning rangers in OaR.
The Power Sword was in a filming picture, but I don't think it got used. But the rangers did use their old sidearms like the Astro Blaster for TJ and so on. As for what is everyone up to... again, while it shouldn't have been, it was a thirty minute episode. I would've preferred they cut the Ninninger movie footage to get a little more focus on the other rangers, but what we got wasn't horrible.
We got A Levi and Antonio moment and we got a Kat and Sarah moment, I think Trent and TJ are the only ones who didn't get a moment where we see them doing something badass. (which is a shame, I agree) But, compared to Once a Ranger, it had double the returning rangers and half the running time. (Which, again, it should've been an hour)
I love the episode, but even I'm hoping for an extended cut, because what we saw did feel rushed and it would be nice to see what an extended cut offers.
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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 17:37:52 GMT -5
I feel like you're still dodging the fact that they were dismissed. That's like if someone got fired but declared they were just gonna keep working anyway for free.
So two things 1) The Retro Rangers definitely each did more than Wes. Even just their intro scene was cooler than anything the non-Tommy rangers did yesterday. I'd say Wes's role in Forever Red is more comparable to Kira's role in OAR. 2) You're using Wes for your argument, when he was one of the only two rangers given something substantial yesterday. Now compare Tori in OAR to Gia. It's like night and day.
So yes "compared to Once a Ranger it had double the returning rangers and half the running time" and a fraction of the character focus and a tenth of the fun.
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Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 29, 2018 18:15:43 GMT -5
I don't think we're gonna agree on most of this DiD stuff, so I'll stick to the one point I have something new to say about it so we don't go in circles. (For example, a tenth of the fun is definitely an opinion thing, and I don't think either of us are trying to change the other's opinion)
I'm not dodging that fact, but there's more to it. One, this isn't just a typical job. This is saving the world. Just calling it quits because you don't have the same amount of power isn't the way to go.
And also, Hartford, their boss, still wanted them. Hartford even said he still needed them, and they quit anyway. That's my problem. We've seen rangers lose their powers and keep fighting... but they didn't just quit. That's what the Overdrive rangers did. They quit on the mission just because they couldn't morph anymore, even when pretty much asked to stay.
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Post by AlwaysARanger85 on Aug 29, 2018 18:20:07 GMT -5
For me I never hated once and I don't think many hate it either. As for dimensions and once they all have positive and negative aspects to them. No episode is ever perfect.
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Post by darkranger237 on Aug 29, 2018 18:40:32 GMT -5
There is one stupid moment Mack using excelsior to flippin slice a giant monster in two.
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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 19:35:10 GMT -5
I mean yeah, I wouldn't want to try and change someone's opinion but I guess I'm just confused. What was fun about watching Rocky do nothing? What was entertaining about seeing TJ's face for literally 3 seconds? It's weird to me because all the major problems that are cited about Legendary Battle were still here, yet suddenly not problems?
Single part episode? Check. Rushed pacing? Check. Lame 2 minute battle where they don't even give each ranger a spotlight part? Check. Tommy being the star? Check. Fly out a bunch of old actors and then have them not do anything? Big, humongous, flaming red check.
Yet despite the fact this committed all the same sins as LB, it's being hailed as much better than the properly paced, better scripted, character focused, Once a Ranger.
I just, I can't understand this. I'm lost.
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Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 29, 2018 19:58:03 GMT -5
That part's where I'll disagree. It didn't really commit all the same sins as Legendary Battle.
Legendary Battle had past rangers show up out of nowhere, some of which didn't even get to speak. At least, while they didn't get enough focus, you actually gave all the rangers a line or two. And actually have them connected to the plot, for that matter. We had a reason the past rangers were there. They were kidnapped and brought there, while another group came to rescue them. It might not be perfect, but it's a reason that they're there. They aren't randomly there just because.
Legendary Battle had a mostly sentai footage battle, where pretty much the only original footage was the Megaforce rangers kicking X-Borgs talking about how LEGENDARY it is to fight along side the past rangers, while not actually showing them fighting along past rangers. Here, we get a cool battle where we actually see the old rangers and the current rangers interacting. Yes, Trent and TJ don't get a moment in the battle, and that sucks, especially because TJ is one of my favorite rangers. But I'll take that over just seeing a bunch of sentai footage that I've already seen mixed with the same stuff I've been watching for a ton of episodes already. That kind of thing works in a regular PR episode, but not an anniversary special.
Some of the problems you listed are problems, yes. But when compared to Legendary Battle, they're... I don't really know how to put it. Better done problems, I guess? Sure, the problems are there, but they're not as bad as when they're done in Legendary Battle.
Nobody is claiming the episode is perfection. But... for a lot of people, it's a fun watch. Me included. I had more fun watching Dimension in Danger than Once a Ranger because there wasn't this weird feeling of seeing our heroes quit. While our villain of DiD isn't well developed, at least his existence is believable, which I can't really say for Thrax.
It comes down to opinions. I find it weird that people could say that Legendary Battle is better than this episode, but at the end of the day, that's their opinion. I just happen to disagree.
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Post by BradyMcKnight on Aug 29, 2018 21:20:07 GMT -5
i guess that's where we differ, cuz I see no value in lines like "Earth will be fine with the Super Ninja Steel Rangers* here!" To me Rocky saying that is equal to Damon saying nothing.
*I also think it's awful that they're being called "Super Ninja Steel" Rangers >_> but that's besides the point.
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