|
Post by crossranger on Aug 13, 2022 21:36:23 GMT -5
"Diversity doesn't have to come at the cost of a good story. I genuinely don't understand that mindset. You can have both. Many shows and movies have both." Sure, as I said, Power Rangers had good stories, but also had diversity. But again, the current political landscape, keeps demanding more "real world" topics than just "larger-than-life, aspirationals" type of stories. A character doesn't have to be the same skin color or sexuality or having the same job to have a good story. Or to inspire people, come on. Superman has doing like more of 80 years of comics, books, tv series, or movies, and it never matter if he was because he was white. He was genuinely a good character, "larger than life". He inspire copycats, creators and real life people. And also, the current landscape of storytelling, with "deconstruction" of superheroes, or characters, I think is not fitted for Power Rangers. (off-topic, but that reminds me that horrible fanfiction of Power/Rangers that was release by that guy Adi something some years ago). For the other part, if Power Rangers aspire to be more mature or not, let's see, but you can't tell "mature" stories inside a kids' show, come on. X-Men in 1992 did it that. Batman TAS too. RPM could be called more mature than MMPR or the Neo Saban (even the Hasbro era). Maturity doesn't mean watching naked people or gore, or shooting or doing drugs, etc. I would shot my screen if they transform Power Rangers in GoT with people having sex every episode, or being, Gosh help us, like Euphoria. Ewwww.
|
|
|
Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 13, 2022 22:30:26 GMT -5
"Diversity doesn't have to come at the cost of a good story. I genuinely don't understand that mindset. You can have both. Many shows and movies have both." Sure, as I said, Power Rangers had good stories, but also had diversity. But again, the current political landscape, keeps demanding more "real world" topics than just "larger-than-life, aspirationals" type of stories. A character doesn't have to be the same skin color or sexuality or having the same job to have a good story. Or to inspire people, come on. Superman has doing like more of 80 years of comics, books, tv series, or movies, and it never matter if he was because he was white. He was genuinely a good character, "larger than life". He inspire copycats, creators and real life people. But the problem people took with the opening post was that it was saying that having those things is something they're against. If you're against the show having stories about characters who are different races, sexualities, religions, whatever, that's a pretty bigoted mindset. People relate to many different kinds of characters, I totally agree. But that's the exact reason there needs to be plenty of character types. If you don't see someone being the same race/gender/sexuality as you as a big deal, that's fine. But if it lets other people feel seen and represented, what's the problem with that? You don't have to do big political commentaries, but that's where the problem is. Stuff like having a gay character in the show shouldn't be viewed as something political, because it's not. Oh, I'm definitely not saying you can't tackle mature subjects in kid's shows. But nobody can argue that being a kid's show DOES come with some limits that shows aimed at older audiences don't get. There's more things to explore outside the realm of a kid's show. Right, but I don't think anyone said that. Just that more mature themes are likely if they're trying to age up the show to a broader audience.
|
|
|
Post by crossranger on Aug 13, 2022 23:13:28 GMT -5
But I am not against races, ethnicities or sexuality, because this is Power Rangers. But I think it's a big assumption, that for somebody watched a character has to be the same race, ethnicity or sexuality, has to fell "represented". I'm latino, but it's a big assumption if I like or has to care about a character just because it's latino, like me. Believe me, just because Rocky, Danny or Z being latinos, it doesn't mean I have automatically put them on my top ten list. Sure, that works for other people. But for me? if the character sucks, it sucks. Which opens another can of worms. It can be criticized? If the "representation" is a character who's badly written, or dislikeable, or just plainly boring, you can say it's bad?
But both sides of the political spectrum viewed it as political. Even for the more progressive ones, it's something political. And for some, it's something you can't criticize.
Limits help creativity. I think sometimes the constrictions and lack of budget could help to being creative. Sure, I can't argue that more money for the actors (instead of paying low salaries, like MMPR ones) or a little more for the special FX's could help the quality of the show, but even in series like Disney plus, with the Boba Fett, of Ms. Marvel, the problem it's not the FXs, or money for actors (or representation), or they have limits, I'm not stupid, and, sure, they have more budget than a regular Power Rangers series, but the problem it's always script and writing.
I think the problem is the "dumbing down" to the audience, but it's not just a problem with Power Rangers exclusively, or kids' show today, but in TV right now. The overexplanation, the "no consequences" for some characters' actions, the preaching or hammering down a theme, or the incorrect exploration of morals are common issues in today's series.
|
|
|
Post by tatsuranger on Aug 13, 2022 23:34:41 GMT -5
"We don't need anything but straight white men in TV." That is legitimately what you're saying right now, just phrasing it different. There's no getting around that now, you just outright said "Diversity doesn't need to be addressed in TV shows" The fact that you're still trying to act as if you're on some kind of high ground is pretty hilarious. Claims they didn't paint me as a racist, here's proof that they did anyway. Otherwise why even say it?
|
|
|
Post by tatsuranger on Aug 13, 2022 23:46:50 GMT -5
But I am not against races, ethnicities or sexuality, because this is Power Rangers. But I think it's a big assumption, that for somebody watched a character has to be the same race, ethnicity or sexuality, has to fell "represented". I'm latino, but it's a big assumption if I like or has to care about a character just because it's latino, like me. Believe me, just because Rocky, Danny or Z being latinos, it doesn't mean I have automatically put them on my top ten list. Sure, that works for other people. But for me? if the character sucks, it sucks. Which opens another can of worms. It can be criticized? If the "representation" is a character who's badly written, or dislikeable, or just plainly boring, you can say it's bad? Yes, you can. But in this day and age, you'll be called a -ist or -phobe if you have valid criticisms against a badly written show if the main character or if the focus of the main character is that they aren't a straight white male. Hollywood isn't showing any signs of not using this shallow mentality anytime and what if this Netflix reboot follows the same suit? Like I said, there's more working against this Power rangers Cinematic Universe than for it.
|
|
|
Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 14, 2022 0:11:54 GMT -5
But I am not against races, ethnicities or sexuality, because this is Power Rangers. But I think it's a big assumption, that for somebody watched a character has to be the same race, ethnicity or sexuality, has to fell "represented". I'm latino, but it's a big assumption if I like or has to care about a character just because it's latino, like me. That's not what I'm saying, though. Firstly, I didn't mean to imply you were the one against all of that. I apologize if that's how it came out, I was meaning to speak in a more general sense in regards to the thread opener. Secondly, nobody has to feel represented by a character being similar to them, but some people do feel represented by it. And that's still valid. Of course. Nobody has to blindly love anything. A poorly written character is a poorly written character regardless of race, sexuality, or whatever else. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but in a general sense, people respond to different things and to say "We shouldn't need this type of character" isn't exactly fair. The problem is when people start bringing up the race or sexuality when talking about why the character sucks, because that shouldn't have anything to do with it. That's something a lot of people are trying their best to change. Seeing an LGBTQ+ character in a show shouldn't be seen some big "political" thing. It should be treated as just any other relationship because that's what it is. If people from both sides are doing it, those people from both sides need to chill. Yeah, of course a good script and good writing is important, but stuck in the box of being a kid's show still has lines you can't cross in terms of danger, relationships, stuff like that. I'm definitely not saying we need to have a bunch of blood and gore and sex and all that. I don't want Power/Rangers again, but the way Power Rangers does things is still very much for young kids. A teen/young adult audience aim could really bring out some more possibilities that weren't there before. There's definitely a case to be made there, I agree. But there are still some very good shows for a teen/young adult/adult audience. I don't want Power Rangers to end up like recent seasons of The Flash (or hell, most CW shows, honestly, but especially The Flash) But still, the kid's show thing definitely plays a part. You're not gonna have stuff like Jane and J-Borg in a young adult show.
|
|
|
Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 14, 2022 0:15:13 GMT -5
"We don't need anything but straight white men in TV." That is legitimately what you're saying right now, just phrasing it different. There's no getting around that now, you just outright said "Diversity doesn't need to be addressed in TV shows" The fact that you're still trying to act as if you're on some kind of high ground is pretty hilarious. Claims they didn't paint me as a racist, here's proof that they did anyway. Otherwise why even say it? Hey now, I claimed I didn't say you were racist. And I didn't. Nowhere in that quote did I say "You are racist." You're changing what was said and replacing it with something else. Sounds like another pathetic strawman to me.
|
|
|
Post by zarius on Aug 14, 2022 6:17:52 GMT -5
Power Rangers has always dealt with diversity in a correct and proper way. When handling any range of topics, it doesn't try to say "women are better, this person of colour is better" like so many other productions. Everyone is presented as an equal
|
|
|
Post by tatsuranger on Aug 14, 2022 7:17:53 GMT -5
Claims they didn't paint me as a racist, here's proof that they did anyway. Otherwise why even say it? Hey now, I claimed I didn't say you were racist. And I didn't. Nowhere in that quote did I say "You are racist." You're changing what was said and replacing it with something else. Sounds like another pathetic strawman to me. Nope. Its obvious that you cant read. You got called out on your BS and now trying your trying to deflect from your painfully obvious attempt to paint someone as a racist. How pathetic.
|
|
|
Post by PowerKamenSentai on Aug 14, 2022 16:01:52 GMT -5
Hey now, I claimed I didn't say you were racist. And I didn't. Nowhere in that quote did I say "You are racist." You're changing what was said and replacing it with something else. Sounds like another pathetic strawman to me. Nope. Its obvious that you cant read. You got called out on your BS and now trying your trying to deflect from your painfully obvious attempt to paint someone as a racist. How pathetic. Oh wow, someone getting called out and using the the words "pathetic strawman" too much to try and pretend their painfully obvious intention actually meant something different. Imagine that. Sounds very obnoxious.
|
|
|
Post by crossranger on Aug 15, 2022 8:57:34 GMT -5
Come on, people, don't fight over this. I would answer over some things tatsuranger said in the beginning.
"Another major reason I'm against it because history speaks for itself and there are MORE working against this than for it.
1.Outside writers.
2.Netflix Involvement.
3.Detachment from Sentai.
4.Unnecessary commentary of Real-life.
5.An effort to rip off the MCU.
6. Risk of MCU-like oversaturation."
1. Power Rangers need desperately new blood. Of course, if you gonna hire writers from failed TV series and movies, probably it wouldn't be the best. 2. Netflix is in a precarious spot, and losing money. Sure, they are cancelling everything unsuccesful, but I think they need something like Power Rangers, a franchise. 3. This could be good....but it depends of the production and the writers. 4. This could be good.....or really terrible. And cringe. And, sincerely, I don't believe there is an obligation to do a commentary aboul social topics. I'm in the middle, and I hate extremisms. 5. Everybody rips off the MCU. DC, Star Trek, Star Wars right now, hell, Kamen Rider has some MCU level of crossovers with Super Sentai, and straight-to-DVD specials. They did it before MCU made it cool. 6. Oversaturation. Sure it's was is killing the MCU right now, (watch the box office of Thor 4 or Dr Strange 2, they weren't great, Spidey NWH saved it because nostalgia, but that won't hold for a lot of time, or failures like Ms. Marvel.)
|
|
|
Post by xman on Aug 20, 2022 17:02:13 GMT -5
Hey, crossranger. I know this may be off-topic to the thread here. But, I just wanted to point out three things you mentioned in your previous post about Latin representation in Power Rangers. In the original pilot of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers (you know, the one with Billy looking too much like a nerd and everyone was hanging out in a bowling alley?!) Trini's character was originally gonna be Latina and obviously, Audrey DuBois was of Latin-decent. So, there's that. But, you know the real reason why DuBois left and why she immediately was replaced why the late, Thuy Trang..... $$$$$$!!!*cue Shane McMahon's WWE entrance theme!!!* and Tracey Lynn Cruz, the actress who played Ashley Hammond, she's Mexican-American. So, shouldn't that also mean that Ashley's character is also Mexican-American?! And finally, Jorgito Vargas, Jr. (Blake Bradley/Navy Thunder Ranger) is half-Bolivian on his father's side and half-Argentinian on his mother's side and his Ninja Storm co-star, Glenn McMillan ("Waldo" Dustin Brooks/Yellow Wind Ranger) is half-Irish on his father's side and half-Brazillian on his mother's side. But in real-life, he speaks fluent Portuguese to stay close to Brazilian heritage. Okay, now I'm done.
|
|
|
Post by crossranger on Aug 20, 2022 19:48:37 GMT -5
I know several actors in Power Rangers are Latinos or descendent of Latinos, I'm pretty aware. I think you just point out how many actors are Latinos, and could play Latino characters (or not, like Tracy Lynn Cruz) but most of the time is not "in your face" representation for the sake of it. Steven Cardenas was colombian-descendent I guess, but even if they point out he was Latino (like in some Alien Ranger episode, when Young Rocky met his grandpa in....some part of LatinAmerica), it wasn't like the big deal. Or young Adam, who was in some part of Korea. Sure, they have ethnicities, but they are not defined by it. I wish actual American television stop making every POC character like just a token of stupid traits.
|
|
|
Post by y2j1915 on Aug 20, 2022 20:34:36 GMT -5
Personally I think everyone needs to be included in media but not at the expense of good writing you can still have good characters that match whatever ethnicity/sexuality/whatever you're trying to represent
|
|
|
Post by tatsuranger on Aug 21, 2022 10:54:13 GMT -5
Come on, people, don't fight over this. I would answer over some things tatsuranger said in the beginning. "Another major reason I'm against it because history speaks for itself and there are MORE working against this than for it. 1.Outside writers. 2.Netflix Involvement. 3.Detachment from Sentai. 4.Unnecessary commentary of Real-life. 5.An effort to rip off the MCU. 6. Risk of MCU-like oversaturation." 1. Power Rangers need desperately new blood. Of course, if you gonna hire writers from failed TV series and movies, probably it wouldn't be the best. 2. Netflix is in a precarious spot, and losing money. Sure, they are cancelling everything unsuccesful, but I think they need something like Power Rangers, a franchise. 3. This could be good....but it depends of the production and the writers. 4. This could be good.....or really terrible. And cringe. And, sincerely, I don't believe there is an obligation to do a commentary aboul social topics. I'm in the middle, and I hate extremisms. 5. Everybody rips off the MCU. DC, Star Trek, Star Wars right now, hell, Kamen Rider has some MCU level of crossovers with Super Sentai, and straight-to-DVD specials. They did it before MCU made it cool. 6. Oversaturation. Sure it's was is killing the MCU right now, (watch the box office of Thor 4 or Dr Strange 2, they weren't great, Spidey NWH saved it because nostalgia, but that won't hold for a lot of time, or failures like Ms. Marvel.) I agree with everything you said. My other issue is that instead of fixing the problems with the current format, they are just gonna abandon it. Like you said, most big name franchises are trying to RIP off the MCU, but like I said, they are failing and floundering for it. Admittedly my scepticism is based on rumors, but I wouldn't put it pass them to throw away 30 years of establishment lore to put all their eggs in the MCU basket. Outside writers, in general, aren't bad, but in recent years you can fill a closet full of examples of outside writers who, like you said, write of terrible or failed TV shows (Hasbro hired the guy who writes for DC'S TITANS as the head writer)or being hired to write for franchises they know NOTHING about, the MOST recent example is She-Hulk. Not to mention bad costume designs galore, most recent example is The Rings of Power. At the end of the day, it's not up to me to blindly accept this endeavor and support it like a mindless corporate shill, it's up to them to prove me wrong and make me a fan. But we'll see.
|
|